>> I CALL THE MEETING TO ORDER AT NOON ON MARCH 20TH, 2024.
[DECLARATION OF A QUORUM AND CALL TO ORDER]
[00:00:05]
WE DO HAVE A QUORUM TODAY.PRESENT ARE JANIE SCHWARTZ-SHAW, BLAINE SMITH, MICHELLE TOWNSEND, GARY DICKEY, AND MYSELF, DANIELLE GRAHAM.
DO WE HAVE A MOTION TO ACCEPT THE MEETING MINUTES FROM DECEMBER 20TH, 2023?
THE SECOND ACTION ITEM WE HAVE IS TO CONDUCT A PUBLIC HEARING DISCUSSION AND TAKE
[ PUBLIC HEARINGS AND ACTION ITEMS]
POSSIBLE ACTION ON A VARIANCE REQUEST FOR A PROPOSED 10'6" HIGH PRIVACY FENCE PER LOCAL GOVERNMENT CODE 211.008 AND SECTION 28-23 OF THE CITY OF ANGLETON CODE OF ORDINANCES SECTION 28-104 FENCING WALLS AND SCREENING REQUIREMENTS, C FENCES AND RESIDENTIAL AREAS.ONE, ANY FENCE OR WALL LOCATED TO THE REAR OF THE MINIMUM REQUIRED FRONT YARD LINE SHALL NOT EXCEED EIGHT FEET IN HEIGHT.
THE SUBJECT PROPERTY IS LOCATED AT 32 COLONY SQUARE, ALSO KNOWN AS BLOCK 1, LOT 15, AND ZONED SINGLE FAMILY RESIDENTIAL SF7.2 DISTRICT.
WE'LL HEAR FROM STAFF FIRST FOLLOWED BY THE APPLICANT.
>> GOOD AFTERNOON. I'M CANDICE HOSLOFF BUNKER.
I AM HERE TO TALK ABOUT THE VARIANCE REQUEST TO ALLOW 10'6" TALL FENCE TO BE CONSTRUCTED BETWEEN TWO RESIDENTIAL ZONE PROPERTIES.
THE LEGAL NOTICE WAS POSTED IN THE LOCAL NEWSPAPER, ON THE CITY'S WEBSITE, AND THE NOTIFICATION BOARD, AS WELL AS MAILED TO PROPERTY OWNERS WITHIN 200 FEET OF THE SUBJECT PROPERTY.
THE APPLICATION WAS FOUND TO MEET SECTION 28-23 F2.
I'LL GO OVER SOME OF THE CONDITIONS THAT WE HAD FOUND.
THE RESULTING DIFFERENCE IN ELEVATION COULD CAUSE NEW HOMES TO BE HIGHER IN TERMS OF THE SITE.
THE ELEVATION MAP PROVIDED THE SUBJECTS ABUTTING PROPERTY LINE ELEVATION TO BE 28.6 TO 28.9 FEET AT THE PROPERTY LINE.
THEN THERE'S A 20 FOOT WIDE EASEMENT BETWEEN THE RIVERWOOD DEVELOPMENT, WHERE THE RIVERWOOD ELEVATION PICKS UP AT 28.83 FEET TO 28.43 FEET.
IT PEAKS TO THE CENTER OF THE CORNER ABUTTING PROPERTY AT 30 FEET 0.5.
IF YOU'RE LOOKING AT THE NUMBERS FOR THE ELEVATIONS OF THE YARD HEIGHT DIFFERENCES, THE APPLICANT SEEKS THE RELIEF TO PROTECT THEIR LEVEL OF PRIVACY AND ENJOYMENT OF THEIR PROPERTY.
THE HOMES IN THE RIVERWOOD SUBDIVISION COULD ALSO BE BUILT TO TWO-STOREY TALL SIMILAR TO THE OTHER RIVERWOOD SECTIONS, WHICH WOULD CREATE ADDITIONAL VISIBILITY CONSISTENT WITH ANY OF THE OTHER CITY NEIGHBORHOODS THAT HAVE TWO-STOREY HOMES.
THE EASEMENT, LIKE I MENTIONED, DOES PROVIDE A 20-FOOT SEPARATION BETWEEN THE COLONY SQUARE PROPERTY LINES AND THE RIVERWOOD PROPERTY LINES.
THE GRANTING OF THE VARIANCE IS NOT EXPECTED TO BE DETRIMENTAL TO THE PUBLIC HEALTH, SAFETY, OR WELFARE OF SURROUNDING PROPERTIES.
IT'S NOT EXPECTED TO CREATE ANY VISIBILITY OR SAFETY ISSUES FOR TRAFFIC.
WE DID WANT TO NOTE THAT IT COULD CREATE A VISUAL INCONSISTENCY IN APPEARANCE WITH THE OTHER FENCES THAT ARE THERE IN COLONY SQUARE NEIGHBORHOOD.
STAFF FINDS THAT THIS VARIANCE WOULDN'T PREVENT THE ORDERLY USE OF OTHER LAND WITHIN THE AREA.
WE AGREE THAT THE FINDINGS OF UNDUE HARDSHIP AND GRADING THE VARIANCE ARE PROPERLY ESTABLISHED.
THE SITUATION IS NEITHER FINANCIAL IN NATURE OR SELF-IMPOSED NOR GENERALLY AFFECTING ALL OR MOST PROPERTIES IN THE SAME ZONING DISTRICT.
THE RELIEF SOUGHT WILL NOT INJURE THE PERMITTED USE OF THE ADJACENT CONFORMING PROPERTIES, AND WE FEEL THAT IT WILL BE IN THE HARMONY AND SPIRIT AND PURPOSE OF THE REGULATIONS.
STAFF DOES CAUTION THAT IF APPROVED, THIS VARIANCE COULD SET PRECEDENCE FOR OTHER PROPERTIES TO REQUEST THE SAME HEIGHT VARIANCE.
WE PREFER NOT TO MAKE THE RECOMMENDATION ON BOA APPEALS, BUT WE'VE PROVIDED A POSITIVE RECOMMENDATION MOTION FOR CONSIDERATION BY THE BOARD. THANK YOU.
>> WE'LL NOW HEAR FROM THE APPLICANT, STUART CHRISTENSEN.
[00:05:02]
>> I THINK SHE COVERED PRETTY MUCH EVERYTHING THAT I WOULD HAVE ALSO COVERED.
MY NAME IS STUART CHRISTENSEN.
I AM THE OWNER AND RESIDENT OF 32 COLONY SQUARE.
LIKE SHE WAS MENTIONING, THE ADJACENT DEVELOPMENT HAS BUILT UP PROBABLY 2-3 FEET AND THEN BY THE TIME YOU ADD A FOUNDATION ON TOP OF THAT, ALL OF MY NEIGHBORS HOUSES ARE MUCH HIGHER THAN MINE.
I HAVE PICTURES ON MY PHONE IF YOU'D LIKE TO SEE THEM, BUT FROM MY BACK PORCH, I CAN LOOK STRAIGHT INTO LIKE THEIR KITCHEN WINDOWS BECAUSE OF HOW EVERYTHING IS SET UP WITH THEIR FENCE IS KIND OF LIKE NESTLED IN THE DRAINAGE EASEMENT, EVEN THEIR BACK FENCE IS SLIGHTLY LOWER AND I CAN LOOK RIGHT INTO THEIR WINDOWS ANYWAYS.
TOMMY FROM STRAIGHT FENCE IS GOING TO BUILD IT.
I KNOW IT'S A LITTLE BIT HIGHER THAN STANDARD, BUT IT'LL BE BUILT TO WITHSTAND STRONG WINDS AND EVERYTHING.
IF YOU HAVE ANY ADDITIONAL QUESTIONS, I'D BE HAPPY TO ANSWER THEM.
>> WELL, I'M SORRY, I HAVE A QUICK QUESTION.
SHOULD I OPEN THE PUBLIC HEARING BEFORE WE ASK QUESTIONS?
>> DOES ANY BOARD MEMBERS HAVE A QUESTION?
>> WE CAN ASK THEM BEFORE THE PUBLIC HEARING.
GO AHEAD, MICHELLE. I'M SORRY.
>> THE PHOTO THAT'S IN THE PACKET BASICALLY JUST SHOWS DIRT WORK.
>> THOSE WERE TAKEN BY STAFF THAT WENT OUT FOR A SITE VISIT?
>> I THINK KYLE. [OVERLAPPING]
>> I GUESS I'M TRYING TO FIGURE OUT, IS THERE A HOUSE THERE NOW?
>> THERE'S NOT A HOUSE THERE NOW.
THERE'S GOING TO BE HOUSES THERE WHERE THAT BARBED WIRE FENCES.
TWENTY FEET FROM THERE, THERE'S GOING TO BE THE PROPERTY LINES FOR THE RIVERWOOD SUBDIVISION SECTION 4.
THEIR BACKYARDS WILL BE BUTTING UP TO THIS YARD, IN THE PROPERTY LINE THERE ALONG COLONY SQUARE SUBDIVISION.
>> RIGHT. MY QUESTION IS WHAT KITCHEN WINDOWS ARE YOU LOOKING INTO?
>> IT'S THE ONE THAT'S CATTY-CORNERED.
THAT SHOULD GIVE YOU LIKE AN IDEA.
[INAUDIBLE] THAT'S WHAT IT WILL LOOK LIKE.
>> THE CORNER THAT'S ALREADY BUILT OUT THERE?
>> YOU CAN TELL IT'S KIND OF BLURRY IN THIS PICTURE BUT IT'S PRETTY CLEAR THERE.
>> THAT WOULD PROBABLY BE 57 AND 58 IN SECTION 1.
>> HOW FAR AWAY IS THAT FROM YOUR BACKYARD?
>> IF I HAD TO GUESS 40 YARDS.
FROM MY BACK PORCH TO THEIR BACK PORCH IS ABOUT 40 YARDS.
BUT FROM MY PROPERTY TO THE START OF THEIR PROPERTY IS 10 FEET.
>> THE DRAINAGE EASEMENT RIGHT HERE IS TWO FEET.
RIGHT NOW, YOU CAN SEE WE HAD BUILT A FENCE THERE AND BECAUSE OF THE GRADE ELEVATION THERE, THIS IS LIKE THREE FEET HIGHER THAN MINE ALREADY.
>> I'D SAY YOU HAVE A QUESTION THOUGH ABOUT THAT BECAUSE AM I READING THAT SCHEMATIC CORRECTLY, THAT THE TWO PROPERTIES ARE SIMILAR IN GRADING? THE 57 IS 28.53.
>> ARE YOU EXPLAINING THE DIFFERENCE?
>> YES, THEY ARE SIMILAR IN GRADING.
THIS IS THE CHRISTIANSON PROPERTY HERE.
THIS IS THE NEW SECTION OF RIVERWOOD.
>> YES, AND THIS IS THE SECTION THAT'S ALREADY BEEN BUILT.
I'M GUESSING THESE ARE WHERE HE CAN SEE INTO THE HOUSE LIVING ROOM OR KITCHEN.
RIGHT HERE IS 28.83, YOU CAN SEE IT RIGHT HERE, 28.83.
>> BUT WOULD YOU MOVE, I GUESS, TO YOUR LEFT AND DOWN THAT 57, AND THEN YOU SEE WHAT LOOKS LIKE A PLUS MARK, 28.53? GO TO YOUR LEFT.
[00:10:04]
>> YES, THIS X RIGHT THERE WOULD BE 28.
>> THAT'S THE SAME ELEVATION AS WHAT IS RIGHT HERE.
>> I FEEL LIKE THERE'S NO WAY THAT THERE'S HOUSE ELEVATION.
>> SO THEY DO BUILD UP AND THEN IT DOES SETTLE.
>> SETTLES. YEAH. I WILL SAY, IN THE PHOTO, IT DID LOOK LIKE THE RIVERWOOD BACK FENCE, ACTUALLY DID SEEM TO BE SLOPED LOWER.
IS THAT BECAUSE THEY'RE ACTUALLY PUTTING IT IN SOME EASEMENT, OR NO? IT'S WHERE IT'S SUPPOSED TO BE.
>> THERE'S A 20-FOOT [INAUDIBLE]
>> I THINK SHE'S TALKING ABOUT THIS EASEMENT.
>> THAT'S A DIFFERENT EASEMENT.
>> SO THAT ONE IS DIFFERENT, BUT IT IS STILL AT THE EDGE 28 AND THEN IT MAY DIP DOWN FOR DRAINAGE, WHERE IT'S MORE OF A DITCH.
>> HOLD ON, I THINK THEY NEED TO GET YOU ON THE RECORD IF YOU CAN ANSWER, BUT ANSWER ON THE RECORD.
>> YES. I WILL ENTERTAIN A MOTION TO OPEN THE PUBLIC HEARING.
>> ANY OPPOSED? MOTION CARRIES.
WE'LL NOW OPEN THE PUBLIC HEARING.
DO WE NEED A SIGN IN SHEET FOR HIM?
>> IF HE CAN GIVE NAME AND ADDRESS
>> YOU CAN FILL OUT SOMETHING.
>> YOU CAN JUST GIVE YOUR NAME AND ADDRESS.
MY BUSINESS IS AT 1727 EAST MULBERRY, STRAIGHT FENCE COMPANY.
WHAT THEY'RE EXPLAINING OR MICHELLE, YOU ASKED THAT IT LOOKED LIKE THE FENCE'S SLOPE.
THEY BUILT THE PADS FOR THE SUBDIVISION, AND WHAT THEY'VE DONE, WHERE THE PAD STARTS GOING DOWN TOWARD THE DRAINAGE, AND I DON'T KNOW WHY, BUT THEY BUILT THE FENCE ON THAT SLOPE, SO THE FENCE IS ACTUALLY SITTING LOWER IF THEY WOULD HAVE BROUGHT IT UP.
STUART'S FENCE, ONCE IT'S BUILT, IT'S GOING TO BE CLOSE TO THE SAME HEIGHT AS RIVERWOOD'S FENCES ON THEIR NEW BUILD.
THEIR FENCE IS SIX-FOOT, SO IT'S SITTING HIGHER ON ELEVATION.
BY THE TIME HE BUILDS TEN-AND-A-HALF, HE'S PROBABLY GOING TO BE SOMEWHERE MAYBE A LITTLE BIT TALLER, MAYBE A LITTLE BIT LESS, BUT IT'S NOT LIKE IT'S GOING TO STICK WAY ABOVE THE NEW FENCES THAT ARE GOING TO BE BUILT AT RIVERWOOD.
THERE'S QUITE A BIT OF ELEVATION CHANGE IF YOU'RE ACTUALLY ON THE PROPERTY AND LOOKED AT IT.
IT'S HARD TO TELL MY NUMBERS OFF A [INAUDIBLE], BUT I DO NOT KNOW WHY THEY BUILT THEM ON A SLOPE.
IT'S ALMOST JUST LIKE THEY DID UP AT THE FAIRGROUNDS WHERE THEIR FENCES ARE FALLING OVER.
IT'S BECAUSE THEY BUILT THEM ON A SLOPE, AND THAT'S WHAT THEY'RE DOING ALONG RIVERWOOD. [INAUDIBLE]
>> NO, I APPRECIATE THE EXPLANATION.
>> I HAVE A COUPLE OF QUESTIONS FOR MR. CHRISTIANSON.
YOU CURRENTLY DOWN, YOU JUST HAVE THIS, LOOKS LIKE A WIRE FENCING AROUND YOUR PROPERTY. IS THAT CORRECT?
>> IS YOUR INTENT TO PUT THE TEN-AND-A-HALF FOOT FENCE ON BOTH SIDES OF YOUR PROPERTY BECAUSE THE OTHER SIDE OF YOUR PROPERTY ABUTS UP TO A COW PASTURE?
>> THAT COW PASTURE BELONGS TO MY PARENTS AND WE SHARE ACCESS TO AND FROM THE PROPERTY, SO NO, I'M NOT PLANNING ON BUILDING THERE.
IN MY FORM HERE MENTION BUILDING ALSO ALONG BETWEEN ME AND MY NEIGHBORS, BUT I FIGURED WHILE I WAS ASKING FOR THE VARIANCE, I WOULD JUST GO AHEAD AND ASK FOR THAT PORTION TOO IN CASE MY NEIGHBOR DECIDED THEY WOULD WANT TO DO THE SAME.
>> IS THERE CURRENTLY A FENCE BETWEEN YOU AND YOUR NEIGHBOR ON THE SIDE?
>> YES. IT'S A SEVEN-FOOT-TALL FENCE, I BELIEVE.
>> IT'S A PRIVACY FENCE AS WELL, AND YOU'RE WANTING TO MAKE THAT TEN-AND-A-HALF FOOT ALSO?
>> IF MY NEIGHBOR WOULD LIKE TO GO IN WITH THAT WITH ME.
>> SO IT'S NOT A DEFINITE YES OR NO, IT'S A MAYBE?
>> DOES YOUR NEIGHBOR HAVE A PRIVACY FENCE IN THE BACK OF THEIR YARD FACING RIVERWOOD?
>> YES. THEY HAVE A SEVEN-FOOT-TALL FENCE IN THEIR BACKYARD LIKE MANY OF THE HOUSES ALONG 32 COLONY SQUARE, BUT ALL OF THOSE FENCES WERE BUILT LONG BEFORE RIVERWOOD EVER CAME IN AND BUILT THE GRADE UP BY 2-3 FEET.
>> BUT THIS NEWER SECTION OF RIVERWOOD, IT'S STILL BEING DEVELOPED.
[00:15:01]
IS THAT CORRECT, CANDACE?>> YES, MA'AM. MATTER OF FACT, WE DON'T HAVE HOUSE PLANS YET ON A LOT OF THEM AND BUILDING PERMITS.
THEY'RE JUST DOING DIRT WORK. THEN THEY WILL COME BACK IN AND GET BUILDING PERMITS FOR THE HOMES AND THINGS LIKE THAT.
SO THAT SECTION IS RIGHT NOW CURRENTLY JUST DIRT WORK.
>> AND DOING UTILITY [INAUDIBLE]?
>> YES, MA'AM, BUT THEY DID SUBMIT THE ELEVATION ON THE PLAT.
SO THAT IS WHAT WE EXPECT THE ELEVATIONS TO BE WHEN THEY GET DONE.
IT MAY LOOK MORE RIGHT NOW, NOT FOR CERTAIN WHAT IT IS LIKE CURRENTLY TODAY, BUT WE EXPECT IT TO BE CONSISTENT WITH THE PLAT AND THE SITE PLANS THAT WERE SUBMITTED.
>> IS THERE A CHANCE THAT THOSE PLANS OR ELEVATION WILL CHANGE AS THEY GO ALONG, AND DOES THAT HAVE TO BE INSPECTED BY THE CITY AS THEY GO ALONG?
>> YES, WE DO HAVE INSPECTORS THAT GO OUT AND LOOK AT THOSE THINGS.
ONE THING TO BE NOTED IS THAT, LIKE YOU MENTIONED, THE PAD SITES, WHICH ARE YOUR FOUNDATION WHEN YOU POUR, IS GOING TO SOMETIMES ADDITIONALLY PROVIDE MORE HEIGHT.
SO IT COULD GO A LITTLE BIT MORE THAN WHAT THE GROUND LEVEL IS AND THAT COULD INCREASE THE HEIGHT EVEN MORE.
>> I ALSO STILL SEE DUMP TRUCKS BRINGING IN LOADS OF DIRT EVERY DAY.
>> IF A TWO-STOREY HOMES ARE BUILT BEHIND YOUR FENCE LINE, IS THAT GOING TO KEEP THE SECOND-STOREY FROM LOOKING INTO YOUR BACKYARD?
>> NO. I WOULD HAVE TO BUILD LIKE A 16-FOOT FENCE FOR THAT.
>> OKAY. I DON'T HAVE ANY FURTHER QUESTIONS.
IS IT GOING TO BE JUST A REGULAR WOODEN PRIVACY FENCE?
>> I'LL LET TOMMY ANSWER THOSE QUESTIONS.
>> I'M SORRY. WE CAN DO IT A COUPLE OF DIFFERENT WAYS.
WE GOT A BALLPARK PRICE WHEN ALL THIS STARTED, BEFORE WE WENT TOO FAR IN IT BECAUSE WE DIDN'T KNOW IF THE CITY WAS GOING TO PROVE IT OR THE VARIANCE OR WHATEVER.
BUT THE OPTIONS ARE THERE TO DO A CEDAR CAP FENCE WITH CEDAR PLANKS, CAP ON TOP.
>> I SHOULD HAVE BROUGHT A BROCHURE IN.
I DIDN'T KNOW I WAS GOING TO BE SPEAKING HERE.
>> IS THAT LIKE A COMMUNITY FENCE?
>> IT'S ALMOST LIKE WHAT THEY BUILT ALONG DOWNING, BUT THEY'LL BE SOMETIMES BIGGER, I PROMISE YOU THAT.
>> IS A CAP LIKE A HORIZONTAL THING?
IF YOU WANT TO SHOW THEM ALSO.
>> THIS IS JUST A SMALL PICTURE OF IT BECAUSE I WAS ZOOMING IN ON IT.
>> IT'S A PRIVACY SCREEN. YEAH.
>> YEAH. I WAS GOING TO SAY IT.
IF YOU'VE SEEN MY FENCE, YOU'VE SEEN IT.
>> THERE'S SEVERAL OPTIONS, WHICH GRANTED, THIS FENCE IS NOT YOUR STANDARD PRICED FENCE EITHER, SO IT'S REALLY WHAT DOES THE CUSTOMER WANT TO SPEND? HOW MUCH DOES HE WANT TO SPEND? WE CAN DO THE CADILLAC OF THEM OR WE CAN DO YOUR STANDARD PRIVACY FENCE.
BUT MOST LIKELY, BEING THAT HEIGHT, WE WILL HAVE TO PUT A CAP ON IT, BECAUSE WE WILL NOT BE ABLE TO GET THE SLACKS, THE PICKETS WITH THE DOLL BEARS ON.
IF NOT, IT'S GOING TO LOOK LIKE IT'S STRAIGHT ACROSS.
I'M 99.9% SURE WE'RE GOING TO HAVE TO PUT A CAP ON IT TO DRESS IT UP.
>> OKAY. I HAVE A COUPLE MORE QUESTIONS FOR MR. CHRISTIANSON.
YOUR NEIGHBOR, LOOKING IN YOUR BACKYARD TO YOUR LEFT, HAS, YOU SAID, A SEVEN-FOOT PRIVACY FENCE?
>> IS YOURS GOING TO GO ZOOM FROM TEN-AND-A-HALF TO SEVEN? IS THERE GOING TO BE A SLOPE?
>> WE COULD DO A SLOPE. THERE WILL BE A ELEVATION DIFFERENCE FOR SURE.
WE HAVEN'T TALKED ABOUT THAT AT ALL.
BUT IN MY HEAD I WAS IMAGINING IT TO JUST GO STRAIGHT TO 10, TO PROVIDE THE MOST PRIVACY.
>> DOES YOUR SUBDIVISION HAVE A HOMEOWNERS ASSOCIATION?
>> OKAY. YOU DON'T HAVE TO HAVE IT APPROVED BY A BOARD AT YOUR HOMEOWNERS OR THERE'S NO BYLAWS THAT PREVENT YOU FROM DOING THIS?
>> CAN I MENTION ONE LAST THING?
[00:20:02]
>> SORRY. AT FREEDOM PARK, WE'RE UNDER CONTRACT FOR A 14.5 FOOT TALL FENCE.
THIS IS 10.5 HERE TO 14.5 AT FREEDOM PARK.
THE ORIGINAL FENCE WE BUILT AT FREEDOM PARK, IT LASTED 10, 12 YEARS, AND WHEN WE GOT TO HIGH WINDS, IT LITERALLY BROKE THE POST.
SOME OF THEM ARE TWO FEET OUT OF THE GROUND, AND IT JUST COMPLETELY SNAPPED THEM.
THE FENCE CAN BE BUILT TO WITHSTAND WINDS IF Y'ALL ARE WORRIED ABOUT THAT TOO.
>> OKAY. IS THE 14-FOOT FOR THE APARTMENTS WHERE THE BASEBALL FIELD IS?
>> SORRY, YOU SAID AT THE PARK.
>> THE REASON THAT FENCE WAS ORIGINALLY BUILT WAS BECAUSE WHEN THE BATTERS AT HOME PLAY, HE LOSES SIGHT OF THE BALL FROM THE PITCHER BECAUSE THE APARTMENTS ARE WHITE, SO YOU CAN'T EVEN SEE THE BALL LEAVE HIS HAND.
KIDS WERE GETTING HURT IS THE ORIGINAL REASON WHY WE BUILT THAT FENCE, AND THEN IT JUST GOT DEMOLISHED DURING THE STORM SO WE'RE UNDER CONTRACT TO REBUILD IT.
>> WELL, COULD WE GO BACK TO THE SCREEN AND HAVE ME POINT SOMETHING OUT? THE ACTUAL SUBDIVISION PLAN.
WELL, THE DRAWING, NOT THE PICTURE.
SORRY. I DON'T WANT ANY CONFUSION ABOUT WHAT I'M TALKING ABOUT.
>> WELL, BUT IT'S THE SCHEMATIC THAT'S RIGHT BELOW THAT PICTURE, RIGHT OTIS? IN OUR PACKET.
>> I THINK SHE WANTS THIS. [INAUDIBLE]
>> THE ONE THAT HAD DIFFERENT COLORS ON IT? IS THAT WHAT YOU'RE LOOKING FOR?
>> OKAY, SO THIS IS 32 COLONY SQUARE.
LIKE TOMMY SAID, IT IS HARD TO VISUALIZE THESE NUMBERS LOOK SO CLOSE, SO I CAN UNDERSTAND YOUR QUESTION ABOUT THE ELEVATION.
BACK IN THIS CORNER, LITERALLY WHEN THEY BUILT IT, I HAD TO CRAWL UP A HILL.
I USED TO HAVE TO CRAWL UP THE HILL, AND MICHELLE, I ACTUALLY HAD YOUR HUSBAND COME OUT AND LOOK AT IT AND I THINK HE WAS QUITE SHOCKED TO SEE HOW HIGH THEY BUILT UP.
THEY START HIGHER BACK IN THE CORNER WITH THE IDEA THAT THE WHOLE SUBDIVISION IS GOING TO SLOPE DOWN TO DOWNING AND HOSPITAL DRIVE FOR DRAINAGE.
ON THAT HILL, THEN THE YARD GOES UP.
AS THEY BUILT, THEY DID, LIKE STUART SAID, HE KEEPS SEEING MORE DIRT COME IN.
THEY DID KEEP DOING THAT AS THEY DUG OUT THE STREETS.
THEY NEVER HAULED DIRT OFF, THEY JUST KEPT PUTTING MORE ON.
WHEN THEY BUILT THE FENCE, THEY ONLY WANTED TO GIVE A 10-FOOT DRAINAGE EASEMENT BETWEEN OUR PROPERTY AND THE OLD FIRST RIVERWOOD.
WE DID TRY TO FIGHT THAT BUT DIDN'T GET ANYWHERE.
BUT THEN THEY WOULDN'T EVEN BUILD THE FENCE UP ON THE TOP OF THE SUBDIVISION.
THEY WANTED TO BUILD IT RIGHT ON THE 10-FOOT LINE, SO THEY CAME DOWN THE HILL AND BUILT IT LOWER NOW.
AS THEY BUILT THOSE FENCES, THEY DUMPED MORE DIRT INTO THE LITTLE DRAINAGE THAT THEY HAD BUILT, WHICH NOW IT DOESN'T DRAIN BECAUSE AS THEY BUILT HOUSES, JUST PUSHED MORE DIRT OFF INTO THERE.
THOSE FENCES ARE ERODING BECAUSE OF THAT SLOPE TOO, AND I'M SURE IT WILL ALL EVENTUALLY FALL, AND SOON WE DON'T EVEN HAVE DIRT THERE ANYMORE.
BUT THERE LITERALLY IS, VISUALLY, A THREE-FOOT DIFFERENCE.
LIKE I SAID, WE HAD SOME COUNCIL MEMBERS COME OUT AND EVEN LOOK AT THAT.
YOU CAN'T SEE IT FROM DRIVING DOWN DOWNING OR HOSPITAL DRIVE, HOW HIGH IT IS THERE.
>> DID ANYBODY ELSE WISH TO SPEAK DURING THE PUBLIC HEARING? I WOULD ENTERTAIN A MOTION TO CLOSE THE PUBLIC HEARING.
>> ANY OPPOSED? THAT MOTION CARRIES.
>> I GOT TWO VERY STRONG COMPETING INTERNAL THOUGHTS.
THE FIRST ONE IS, I MEAN, I'M A VERY HUGE PROPONENT OF PRIVATE PROPERTY RIGHTS AND GETTING TO DO WHAT YOU WANT ON YOUR OWN LAND.
THEN THE OTHER ONE THAT JUST KEEPS STICKING WITH ME,
[00:25:01]
AND IT'S PROBABLY BECAUSE I'M A LAWYER, IS THIS RIGHT FOR OUR CONSIDERATION YET? THE REASON WHY I EVEN SAY THAT IS BECAUSE ON PAGE 7, WHEN WE'RE TALKING ABOUT 28-23(A), SPECIAL CIRCUMSTANCES, STAFF CONFIRMS, AND THEY USE THE LANGUAGE, COULD.THAT TO ME JUST FEELS SPECULATIVE.
I FEEL BAD FOR MR. CHRISTIANSON THAT IT WOULD ALMOST BE LIKE YOU WOULD HAVE TO WAIT UNTIL THEY ACTUALLY PUT A HOUSE THERE TO SEE IF EIGHT FEET IS SUFFICIENT OR IF YOU ACTUALLY NEED 10 FEET.
I GUESS THAT'S MY CONCERN, IS THAT EIGHT FEET IS PRETTY HIGH.
COULD IT MAYBE BE ENOUGH BUT WE JUST DON'T KNOW YET BECAUSE THE DIRT HASN'T SETTLED, BECAUSE THERE'S NOT A FOUNDATION THERE? YOU SEE WHAT I'M SAYING?
>> BUT THERE ARE HOUSES THERE.
>> I THINK, UNFORTUNATELY, WE HAD TO MAKE AN INTERPRETATION BECAUSE IT DEPENDS ON WHAT YOU PERCEIVE TO BE THE SIGHT LINE.
BECAUSE SIGHT LINE WAS MENTIONED.
SIGHT LINE COULD MEAN, HEY, I MEANT AT THE FIRST FLOOR LOOKING OUT, BUT WE DON'T KNOW IF IT'S GOING TO BE A TWO-STOREY HOME VERSUS A ONE-STOREY HOME.
THAT'S WHY WE SAID COULD FROM THAT STANDPOINT.
BUT I THINK TODAY WE'VE ESTABLISHED THE MERE FACT THAT IT COULD BE A TWO-STOREY HOME.
WHETHER OR NOT IT WOULD SOLVE THE PROBLEM, MAYBE NOT, BUT FROM YARD TO YARD, IT WOULD PROBABLY SOLVE THE ISSUE OF PRIVACY AS WITH MOST SUBDIVISIONS. THANK YOU.
>> WELL, I KNOW IT'S A LITTLE OFF TOPIC, BUT I WOULD LIKE THE RECORD TO REFLECT THAT I THINK WHAT WE'VE DISCUSSED ABOUT THE PLACEMENT OF RIVERWOOD'S PRIVACY FENCES IS PART OF THE PROBLEM WITH THE CONSTRUCTION IN THAT NEIGHBORHOOD, PERIOD.
I MEAN, YOU HAVE SOMEONE WHO DOES FANTASTIC WORK TELLING YOU THESE FENCES ARE GOING TO FALL DOWN BECAUSE THEY'RE BUILT ON THE SLOPE.
>> I KNOW THAT'S NOT THE ISSUE IN FRONT OF US RIGHT NOW, BUT THAT'S NOT GOOD.
>> I MEAN, IT'S THE EXACT SAME BY THE FAIRGROUND.
THEY DID THE EXACT SAME. THEY PUT IT ON A SLOPE.
>> THEY'RE GOING TO FALL THERE. YEAH.
>> WELL, MY CONCERN IS THAT THERE AREN'T ANY HOUSES BUILT JUST YET BEHIND THE PROPERTY, DIRECTLY BEHIND IT.
THERE IS DIAGONALLY I GUESS YOU'D SAY, BUT NOT BEHIND IT, SO WE DON'T KNOW WHEN THOSE HOUSES WILL BE BUILT.
IF THERE WILL BE HOUSES THERE, WHAT HOUSES WILL BE THERE? IS A TEN-AND-A-HALF-FOOT FENCE JUSTIFIED AT THIS TIME WITHOUT KNOWING WHAT'S GOING TO BE THERE? THAT'S MY CONCERN.
THEN A YEAR OR TWO FROM NOW, THERE'S A HOUSE BUILT THERE, IS THAT TEN-AND-A-HALF-FOOT FENCE SERVING ITS PURPOSE? MAYBE, MAYBE NOT.
>> I HAVE A QUESTION. IF WE GRANT A VARIANCE, IS THERE A WAY TO SAY THAT IT NEEDS TO TIE IN? BECAUSE I'M VISUALIZING THE BACKSTOP AT FREEDOM PARK WHERE IT DOES STEP DOWN REALLY NICELY AND IT LOOKS REALLY NICE.
CAN YOU MAKE IT TO WHERE THAT WAY IT WOULD HAVE TO TIE IN NICELY WITH-
>> YOU CAN CONDITION A GRADUAL ANGLE WHERE IT LOOK CONSISTENT BECAUSE WE'VE SEEN THAT BEFORE. YES.
>> CAN YOU DO THAT WITH THE TOP CAP ON IT? TECHNICALLY, BECAUSE I'M NOT SUPPOSED TO ASK YOU QUESTIONS BECAUSE YOU'RE NOT IN PUBLIC HEARING, BUT CAN YOU DO THAT IF YOU PUT THE TOP CAP?
>> I CAN TAKE IT FROM WHATEVER HEIGHT TO WHATEVER HEIGHT.
YOU GO FROM FREEDOM PARK, FOURTEEN-AND-A-HALF TO FOUR FOOT.
>> I THINK THEY SAID THOUGH THAT THEY WERE NOT GOING TO PLACE A FENCE AT THE BACK BETWEEN THE PASTURE.
WHEN YOU SAY, WOULD IT JUST, HERE, TAPER DOWN TO THE NEIGHBOR TO THE EAST?
>> BECAUSE IT WOULD LOOK FUNKY.
YOU HAVE A TEN-AND-A-HALF FOOT FENCE DOWN TO A SEVEN FOOT FENCE OR EIGHT FOOT FENCE, YOU'VE GOT A 2-3 FOOT DROP OFF.
AESTHETICALLY, IT WOULDN'T BE VERY PLEASING, BUT I SEE THE PURPOSE OF IT.
>> IF I DID HAVE TO TAPER IT AT THE OTHER END, I WOULD STILL BE ABLE TO SEE INTO THAT KITCHEN.
>> YOU'RE TALKING ABOUT THE CORNER?
>> YEAH. FRONT AND BACK PORCH.
THE NEIGHBOR THAT'S [INAUDIBLE] NOW.
I TAPERED IT DOWN [INAUDIBLE] THAT ONE IS NOT [INAUDIBLE].
>> SO THAT FENCE WOULD JUST END THEN?
>> AT THE CORNER, IT WOULD JUST END.
[00:30:01]
>> BUILDING JUST A FENCE ON THAT ONE SIDE OF YOUR PROPERTY, WILL HOUSES OVER HERE BE ABLE TO SEE IN THIS SIDE SINCE YOU'RE NOT WANTING TO PUT A FENCE ON THAT SIDE BECAUSE IT'S A COW PASTURE?
>> CAN YOU REPEAT THE QUESTION?
>> IF YOU'RE GOING TO PUT JUST A FENCE BUILDING SIDE OF THE SECTION 2.
THEN ON THE WEST SIDE, THERE'S THE COW PASTURE AND YOU'RE NOT GOING TO PUT A FENCE.
IS THAT GOING TO KEEP ANY HOUSES FROM OVER HERE FROM SEEING IN YOUR NEIGHBORHOOD INTO YOUR BACKYARD IF THERE'S NO FENCE ON THIS SIDE?
>> ARE YOU TALKING ABOUT ACROSS THE [INAUDIBLE]?
>> HE'S TALKING ABOUT WHERE YOU WANT TO BUILD THE BARN.
>> HE'S PLANNING ON BUILDING THE BARN THERE.
>> AND DOES THAT ALLOW FOR A VISUAL?
>> YES, IT DOES, AND I WOULD LOVE FOR THAT FENCE TO KEEP BUILDING ANOTHER T, BUT I THEN HAVE TO SEE THE NEXT TWO OR THREE HOUSES DOWN THAT THE SAME ISSUE IS THERE, BUT THAT'S MY PARENTS PROPERTY.
>> IN ADDITION, THERE'S A COST ASSOCIATED WITH THE TWO, SO IN MY HEAD, I WAS JUST GOING TO STOP THERE.
MY PARENTS AND I HAVE BEEN TALKING ABOUT BUILDING A BARN RIGHT THERE WHICH WOULD SERVE THE SAME PURPOSE AS OF CONTINUING THAT.
>> AM I READING IT RIGHT? THAT WHAT WE'RE REFERRING TO IS THE COW PASTURE ZONED FOR DUPLEXES?
I KNOW IT'S A COW PASTURE BECAUSE I'VE SEEN IT, BUT IT'S ZONED FOR DUPLEXES?
>> IF YOU LOOK AT THIS MAP RIGHT THERE.
>> I DROVE BY THERE BECAUSE I'M LIKE, THERE'S NO HOUSES THERE. THAT'S A COW PASTURE.
>> THEY HAVE THESE LOTS THAT HAVE ALREADY BEEN PLANTED FOR DUPLEXES.
DO YOU KNOW WHICH ONES THEY ARE? THERE'S THE BIG DITCH.
>> WELL, ON THE OTHER SIDE OF THE DITCH, THIS WAS ALSO ZONED FOR DUPLEXES, BUT I WOULD ALSO SAY THAT THIS PART HERE, THESE LOTS HAVEN'T BEEN BUILT OUT BECAUSE THEY CAN'T MEET THE BUILDING SETBACK LINES.
THIS ONE, IT DOESN'T HAVE A WHOLE LOT OF ROAD FRONTAGE, SO IT WOULD BE DIFFICULT FOR THEM TO BUILD THEIR ROADWAY IN, BUT THEN THEY COULD POTENTIALLY PUT DUPLEXES IF THEY SOLD THE PROPERTY TO SOMEONE ELSE THAT WAS OF MIND TO DO THAT.
>> CAN I SPEAK ONE THING TO YOUR QUESTION?
>> YOU RAISED THE CONCERN ABOUT HOUSES NOT BEING THERE, AND I'D LIKE TO ARGUE THAT THEIR PRECEDENT HAS BEEN SET.
AND VISUALLY, JUST BECAUSE IT'S NOT THE NEW PART DIRECTLY BEHIND THE HOUSE, IT IS THE ORIGINAL PART OF RIVERWOOD.
THE HOUSES ARE THERE AND IT HAS ALREADY CREATED THE PRIVACY ISSUE.
JAMIE, YOU HAD QUESTIONS TOO. THAT'S HALF YOUR QUESTION.
>> I DON'T RECALL WHAT IT WAS NOW.
MY QUESTION WAS NOW WE GOT THIS MAP UP, SO THIS IS YOUR PROPERTY.
A FENCE IS GOING TO BE PUT HERE.
IS THE FENCE HERE GOING TO KEEP THIS HOUSE FROM SEEING BACKYARD?
>> IT WON'T. THERE'S A PROBLEM.
I WAS ENCOURAGING TO WRAP THE FENCE A LITTLE WAYS JUST TO HELP WITH THAT, BUT THIS IS WHERE WE'VE ALWAYS USED THIS AS OUR BACKYARD, AND WE'VE CONSIDERED BUILDING A BARN STRUCTURE BACK HERE, WHICH WOULD BE HIGH ENOUGH TO THEN NOT NEED THE FENCE THERE BECAUSE THAT WOULD HELP BLOCK THAT VIEW.
>> COULD YOU BUILD A BARN THERE THOUGH WITHOUT A FENCE?
>> THAT'S WHAT I WAS GOING TO SAY.
IT SHOULD ALSO BE NOTED THAT IF THEY WERE GOING TO BUILD, THERE WOULD BE PROBABLY SETBACKS FROM THE PROPERTY LINE.
SO IT WOULDN'T TECHNICALLY BE RIGHT THERE IN THE CORNER RIGHT ON THE PROPERTY LINE.
>> THERE'S A 10-FOOT VARIANCE.
>> I THINK COMMISSION MEMBER WAS ASKING IN TERMS OF THE USE WOULD THE STORAGE BUILDING BE PERMITTED.
WE'VE EXPLAINED TO THE PROPERTY OWNER THAT ABSENT THE MAIN STRUCTURE, YOU CANNOT DO A BARN, BUT IT COULD BE A BARNDOMINIUM HOME THAT WOULD
[00:35:03]
INCORPORATE THE BARN AND THE HOME TOGETHER.IT COULD OCCUR ON THAT PARTICULAR ZONING AS A BARNDOMINIUM.
>> WITHOUT A VARIANCE EVEN THOUGH IT ZONED AS TWO-FAMILY RESIDENTIAL?
>> YOU CAN PUT A SINGLE-FAMILY HOME.
>> IF THAT'S THE CASE, I DON'T KNOW IF I CAN AFFORD ANOTHER BARNDOMINIUM.
CAN I REQUEST TO ADD THAT BACK PROPERTY LINE TO THE VARIANCE SO THAT I COULD BUILD THERE AS WELL?
>> COULD HE WRAP THE FENCE, HE'S ASKING.
>> ANYTHING THAT HAPPENS ON THIS PROPERTY COULD BE MODIFIED IF THERE'S A CONCERN TO ENHANCE THE PRIVACY OR TO ALLOW FOR THE PRIVACY.
SO IF YOU BROUGHT IT FIVE OR SIX FEET ON THAT WESTERN LINE, JUST A LONG AS WHAT YOU DO HAS TO DO WITH THIS PARTICULAR PIECE OF PROPERTY.
OTHERWISE, EVERYONE HAS BEEN NOTIFIED WITHIN 200 FEET OF THE CASE.
SO I DON'T THINK YOU WILL BE DOING ANYTHING OUTSIDE OF YOUR AUTHORITY IF YOU WERE TO EXTEND IT SIX FEET ON THE WEST LINE AND TAPER IT DOWN, WHATEVER YOUR CONDITION WOULD BE CRAFTED AS.
>> LET ME POINT OUT SINCE I DON'T KNOW WHAT DIRECTION WE'RE GOING.
>> DOES THIS NEIGHBOR HAVE A PRIVACY FENCE ON THE BORDER?
>> THEY DO NOT. IT'S A CHAIN LINK FENCE.
>> THEY HAVE A PRIVACY FENCE RIGHT HERE.
>> IN BETWEEN BUT NOT IN THE BACK.
>> BUT NOT IN THE BACK. THEY'D LIKE TO BE ABLE TO SEE THE COWS.
>> SO THE SEPARATING PRIVACY FENCE IS AT SIX FEET CURRENTLY?
>> SEVEN. THAT'S WHAT THE OTHER FENCE ON THE-
>> THE OTHER COMMENT I WAS GOING TO BE MAKING ABOUT IT JUST STOPPING VERSUS A REQUIREMENT TO TAPER IT DOWN IS, THIS NEIGHBOR KNOWS ABOUT IT AND HAS NO OPPOSITION TO IT.
>> THEY WILL PROBABLY WISH THEY HAD ATTENDED THIS.
THEY ARE NOT [INAUDIBLE] TO WHAT HAS BEEN BUILT YET.
THEY PROBABLY DON'T KNOW WHAT'S COMING.
>> I DON'T THINK ANY OF US NECESSARILY KNOW WHAT'S COMING THOUGH.
EVEN THOUGH THERE'S BEEN PLAQUES AND REQUESTS AND INSPECTIONS, IT MAY OR MAY NOT HAPPEN THAT WAY.
>> YOU THINK THAT MAYBE NO HOUSE IS GOING TO BE BUILT THERE? THAT'S OBVIOUSLY A POSSIBILITY.
I THINK THERE WILL BE HOUSES BUILT THERE, BUT THAT'S STILL A POSSIBILITY.
>> THEY'LL START IN JULY OR AUGUST.
>> THIS FENCE, I KNOW WE'VE MENTIONED WHETHER IT'D BE A ONE-STOREY OR A TWO-STOREY HOUSE BEING BUILT AND WE DON'T HAVE ANY WAY TO KNOW RIGHT NOW SO THE FENCE HEIGHT, IF WE WERE TO GRANT THE ADJUSTMENT, IT WOULD PREVENT FIRST-FLOOR VISIBILITY?
>> THE HOUSE THAT'S A CORNER AND ALREADY BUILT YET.
I CAN SEE IN THE THIRD PEOPLE'S FIRST FOES, AT LEAST FOR THE TWO HOMES EXISTING ON THE CORNER.
SO EXPECTING IT TO BE THE SAME SITUATION, ONLY CLOSER.
>> FOR THE FENCE EXPERT HERE, IS 10.5 ABSOLUTELY NEEDED OR WOULD A NINE-FOOT FENCE SUFFICE?
>> I SUGGESTED 10.5 BECAUSE NOT ONLY BELIEVE IT OR NOT, IT WILL COME OUT CHEAPER THAN HIM DOING A NINE-FOOT FENCE.
SO HE MIGHT AS WELL GET MORE FENCE FOR HIS BUCK TO COVER MORE HEIGHT OF VISIBILITY.
BECAUSE ONCE WE GO TO NINE-FOOT FENCE IT'S GOING TO END UP COSTING MORE MONEY BECAUSE WE CAN GET TEN, PUT A ROCK ON THE BOTTOM AND HE'S OPEN.
THAT'S GOOD. I SUGGEST I'M THE ONE THAT SUGGESTED 10.5, BECAUSE I DON'T THINK ALL WORK.
AND THE REASON BEING, IT'S AND IT'S VERY HARD TO TELL ON THE NUMBERS.
BUT WHEN YOU'RE ON SITE, YOU'RE STANDING IN HIS YARD IN RIVERWOOD, I'M NOT KIDDING.
RIVERWOOD, WHEN I WAS OUT THERE MONTHS AGO, IS A GOOD THREE FEET FROM HIS ANGER.
>> THAT IS NOT AN EXAGGERATION.
>> SO, I MEAN, I DON'T KNOW IF Y'ALL COULD MAKE TIME TO GO OUT THERE OR WHATEVER, BUT IT REALLY IS. IT REALLY IS.
I MEAN, IT'S PRO EVERY BIT THREE FEET,
[00:40:02]
THEY THEY BROUGHT IN SINCE I WAS THERE MONTHS AGO.I KNOW ON THE NUMBERS IT SAYS 0.3 0.4 DIFFERENT.
BUT ACTUALLY LOOKING AT IT AND I THOUGHT I HAD A PICTURE, THAT'S WHAT I WAS LOOKING FOR.
BUT IT LOOKS 33 FEET DIFFERENT FROM STUART'S GRADE FROM HIS GROUND LEVEL TO WHAT THEY'VE ALREADY ADDED.
BAKER AND LAWSON, I WAS JUST ON-SITE THERE BECAUSE THEY CONTRACTED US LAST WEEK TO CUT A HOLE IN THE FENCE ON ONE OF THE HOUSES ALREADY BEING BUILT BECAUSE THEY NEEDED TO RUN A NEW WATER LINE AND THOSE FENCES AREN'T A YEAR OLD AND ARE ALREADY FALLING OVER.
AS I WAS THERE, THEY WERE STILL HAULING DIRT, AND THEY WERE HAULING DIRT RIGHT BEHIND STUART'S HOUSE, YOU KNOW? SO THEY'VE GOT PILES OF DIRT EVERYWHERE.
HOW MUCH MORE ARE THEY ACTUALLY GOING TO BUILD UP? TO ANSWER YOUR QUESTION, I'M NOT GOING TO SIT HERE AND TELL YOU 10.5 FEET TALL ENOUGH WHEN IT'S ALL SAID AND DONE.
YOU KNOW, HE MAY HAVE WISH HE ASKED FOR 16 FOOT. I DON'T YOU KNOW WHAT I MEAN.
BUT IT'S A BIG ELEVATION CHANGE.
HOPEFULLY, I KNOW THEY'RE NOT GOING TO REMOVE IT.
>> WHICH I GUESS GOES BACK TO ONE OF MY FIRST QUESTIONS, WHICH MAYBE IS A QUESTION REALLY FOR THE PROPERTY OWNER, IS WOULDN'T YOU RATHER WAIT AND SEE EXACTLY WHAT YOU'RE DEALING WITH BEFORE YOU BUILD? I'M NOT HERE TO TELL YOU WHAT TO DO WITH YOUR PROPERTY.
I GUESS I'M JUST VISUALIZING IN MY HEAD THE ONLY THING I THINK I COULD BE COMFORTABLE WITH BECAUSE I FEEL LIKE WHAT WE'RE DOING HERE TODAY IS GOING TO SET A PRECEDENT.
IT'S GOING TO HAVE TO BE BOTH SIDES OF THAT BACKYARD, AND IT CAN BE 10.5 FEET, BUT THEN I THINK IT NEEDS TO TAPER IN AN AESTHETICALLY PLEASING WAY DOWN TO THE SIDE PRIVACY FENCES IF THAT'S WHAT WE'RE BEING ASKED TO DO TODAY. YOU SEE WHAT I MEAN?
>> MY CONCERN WITH THAT IS, AS YOU SAY, IT'S SETTING A PRECEDENT.
AS THESE HOMES ARE BUILT AND THE NEIGHBORS REALIZED, OH, I GET A BIGGER FENCE, THEN WE'VE GOT THIS ONE TAPERED.
>> SO NOW THEY'RE GOING TO HAVE TO TAPER.
>> WE'RE GOING TO HAVE TO DO THIS.
WELL, BUT THEN WE'LL HAVE TO DO ANOTHER VARIANCE BECAUSE THIS VARIANCE WILL REQUIRE A TAPER.
>> WELL, YOU PUT WORD IT THOUGH TOO.
GRADUALLY SLOPE TO MEET THE NEIGHBORING FENCE AND ADJOINING FENCE.
AND THEN IF THERE'S NO NEED TO GRADUALLY TAPER, THERE'S NO NEED TO GRADUALLY TAPER.
>> AT 10.5, YOU'RE ONLY GOING TO SEVEN FOOT IS THE NEIGHBORS, SO IT'S NOT GOING TO BE MUCH SLOWER.
AGAIN, AND I'M REFERRING BACK TO FREEDOM PARK BECAUSE OF ITS TALL FENCE, IT'S FROM 14.5 TO FOUR FOOT.
YOU'RE PROBABLY TALKING, I CAN PROBABLY DO THAT SLOPE IN A SEVEN-FOOT SECTION WHICH IS ONE SECTION OF FENCE WHICH STILL GIVES YOU A LOT OF THE PRIVACY YOU'RE LOOKING FOR.
BECAUSE IT'S GOING 10.5 TO SEVEN.
>> I WOULD BE HAPPY WITH THE TAPER.
I DO THINK THAT I PROBABLY WON'T BE THE ONLY ONE IN HERE.
I THINK LOTS OF ONCE HOUSES ARE BUILT, YOU'LL PROBABLY HAVE OTHER NEIGHBORS WANTING TO DO THE SAME THING.
IF THEY'VE ALREADY GOT A SEVEN-FOOT PRIVACY FENCE, WILL THEY WANT TO UPGRADE? I DON'T KNOW, BUT I DON'T HAVE A PRIVACY FENCE TO BEGIN WITH.
TO ANSWER YOUR QUESTION EARLIER, AS NICE AS IT WOULD BE TO WAIT AND KNOW THE EXACT HEIGHT THAT I NEED, I'M PRETTY CONFIDENT THAT 10.5 WILL COVER UP THE FIRST FLOOR.
I KNOW I'M GOING TO NEED SOMETHING RIDICULOUS, LIKE 14 OR 16 FEET TO COVER UP SECOND-STOREY HOMES.
I'VE GOT A TWO-YEAR-OLD DAUGHTER AND A WIFE THAT WORKS FROM HOME, SO I WOULD MUCH PREFER TO HAVE THE FENCE IN PLACE BEFORE CONSTRUCTION STARTS, SO I DON'T HAVE TO HAVE CONSTRUCTION WORKERS LOOKING IN MY YARD FOR THE NEXT YEAR OR TWO YEARS, WHATEVER IT IS.
>> I HAVE A QUESTION. IF HE GETS A 10.5 FOOT FENCE AND THE NEIGHBOR NEXT DOOR HAS A SEVEN, AND THEN THE NEIGHBOR NEXT DOOR COMES IN HERE AND ASKS FOR A NINE-FOOT VARIANCE, WE COULD END UP WITH FENCES GOING LIKE THIS UP AND DOWN THE ROW OF THAT, POTENTIALLY.
[00:45:04]
>> IF WE WERE TO I'M JUST GOING TO ASK YOU BECAUSE I'M NOT QUITE SURE I UNDERSTOOD.
IF WE WERE TO GRANT THE VARIANCE WITH THE TAPER IN THE VARIANCE, AND THEN THE NEIGHBOR COMES AND GETS AN ADJUSTMENT AND WE REQUIRE THEIR TAPER.
THEN WHEN THEY DECIDE, SINCE THEY'RE BOTH HAVE THE SAME HEIGHT TO RAISE THE TAPER, DO THEY HAVE TO COME AGAIN TO GET A VARIANCE TO THE TAPER? I DON'T KNOW IF I SAID THAT. IT DOESN'T SOUND LIKE IT.
>> NO, I UNDERSTAND WHAT YOU'RE SAYING, YOU'RE SAYING, CORRECT?
>> I DON'T THINK THEY DO BECAUSE IF WE'RE SAYING IT HAS TO TAPER TO THE ADJOINING FENCE, BUT THEN ALL OF A SUDDEN THE ADJOINING FENCE IS WHAT THE OTHER FENCE IS. THERE'S NO TAPER.
>> SO WE GRANT THE NEXT VARIANCE BECAUSE YOU WOULD AUTOMATICALLY EVEN IT OUT AND THEN THEY COULD JUST MEET. YES.
>> MAXIMUM HEIGHT. SO IF THE COMPANY WITH THE POOL CAME IN AND GOT A VARIANCE, HE STILL HAS THE ABILITY TO REMOVE THAT ONE SET RIGHT.
AND MAKE HIS TOTAL 10.6 TO MEET THERE.
I DON'T THINK YOU NEED TO DO IT.
>> I JUST WHEN YOU SAID IT SETS A PRECEDENT THE WHOLE TIME WE'RE GOING TO HAVE A LOT OF THESE MEETINGS WHEN THESE HOUSES GO IN I FEEL LIKE.
YEAH. FOR THE WHOLE, I MEAN, THAT WHICH IS WHY I SAY IF WE'RE GOING TO DO IT RIGHT NOW, THE ONLY WAY I THINK I'D BE COMFORTABLE IS IF IT IS BOTH THOSE SIDES AND BOTH TAPER TO THE NEIGHBOR TO THE NORTH AND THE NEIGHBOR TO THE EAST PROPERTY FENCE, PRIVACY FENCE.
>> I WOULD ENTERTAIN A MOTION TO GRANT A VARIANCE TO SECTION 28-104 FENCING FOR A 10.5 FOOT PRIVACY FENCE AT THE REAR NORTHSIDE.
>> IF WE'RE GOING TO REQUIRE A TAPER ON BOTH ENDS, COULD I PLEASE ASK TO BE ABLE TO WRAP? COULD I BRING IT DOWN HERE ANOTHER 10 FEET AND THEN TAPER IT?
>> WELL, I'LL BE HONEST. WHAT I'M SAYING IS IT WOULD BE TO THE NEXT PRIVACY FENCE.
>> THERE'S NO THERE'S NO PRIVACY, THAT'S PASTURE.
>> YES. THANK YOU, MICHELLE. I THINK I KNOW EXACTLY WHERE YOU'RE AT.
>> STAY HOME. THIS IS HIS PARENTS.
>> I WOULD PREFER NOT TO PAY FOR ANOTHER 100 FEET OF FENCE IF I COULD JUST GO 20 FEET SO THAT THE COST ISN'T ENORMOUS.
THIS PATH HERE, WE USED FOR TRAILERS ON RVS, SO WE TAKE IT INTO THE COW PASTURE, AND IF I CONNECT THE TOO, I'D HAVE TO PUT IT HERE.
>> HOW FAR IN WOULD BE 20 FEET?
SO 20 FEET WOULD BE ABOUT RIGHT HERE.
>> THEN FROM THE 20 FOOT, IT WOULD TAPER?
>> YEAH. SO LIKE FROM HERE, IT PROBABLY GO 10 FEET HERE AND THE TAPER, I DON'T KNOW WHAT.
IF I OWN THAT PROPERTY, IT'S NOT VISUALLY BOTHERSOME TO ME IF IT DOESN'T TAPE.
>> IF IT'S NOT GOING ALL THE WAY TO THE OTHER NEIGHBOR'S FENCE, THEN THERE'S NO POINT IN TAPERING IT, IN MY OPINION.
>> CONTINUING FROM THE PRIVACY FENCE, IS THERE BARBED WIRE THERE NOW BETWEEN THE TWO PROPERTIES? IT'S JUST OPEN.
>> IT'S JUST WIRE. IT'S NOT BARBED WIRE.
>> SO LIKE ALL OF THIS IS A WIRE FENCE.
>> RIGHT HERE THERE IS A WOODEN FENCE HERE, BUT IT'S MORE OF AN AESTHETICS FENCE.
IT'S NOT REALLY DOING ANYTHING.
YOU CAN SEE RIGHT THROUGH IT, IT'S MORE FOR LIKE MINDS GOING THROUGH IT.
BUT YEAH, I HOPE THAT ANSWERS THE QUESTION.
>> MICHELLE, WOULD YOU LIKE TO COME UP WITH THE WORDING? MADAM LAWYER?
>> I GOING TO ALSO WANT TO POINT OUT, IT MAY OR MAY NOT HAVE OTHER PEOPLE COMING, BECAUSE ON THIS PART OF RIVERWOOD AND THE PART THAT'S ALREADY THERE.
[00:50:02]
THERE IS THAT VISUAL THING TOMMY IS TALKING ABOUT WHERE, WOW, THEY'RE BUILT UP ON A HILL.AS YOU GET ALL THE WAY TO DOWNING STREET, IT GETS CLOSER.
IF YOU'RE DRIVING BY ON DOWNING, YOU MIGHT SEE A LITTLE DIFFERENCE, BUT IT'S NOT LIKE THE DIFFERENCE BACK IN THIS CORNER.
WILL IT BE THAT WAY GOING TO BUCHTA? MAYBE. I DON'T KNOW.
BUT THE ELEVATIONS ARE RIGHT BUT IF THE DRAINAGE ENGINEERING WORKS THE SAME WAY AS IT DID IN THE OLD RIVERWOOD, THE PEOPLE CLOSER TO BUCHTA MAY NOT HAVE THAT SAME VARIATION AND WE NEED FOR, I DON'T KNOW.
>> I CAN GIVE IT A WHIRL OR YOU CAN?
>> THAT'S WHAT I'M STRUGGLING WITH IS IF YOU WERE JUST GOING TO BUILD AN EIGHT-FOOT FENCE, YOU PUT IT ON HOWEVER MUCH OF YOUR YARD, AND WE DON'T HAVE TO SAY ANYTHING AT ALL ABOUT IT BECAUSE IT'S ALREADY PROVIDED FOR.
BUT THE ONLY REASON WHY WE GET A SAY IS BECAUSE YOU'RE ASKING TO GO ABOVE EIGHT FEET WHICH AGAIN, FOR US, SETS A PRECEDENT OF IF WE'RE GOING TO ALLOW A FENCE THAT HIGH, WHAT KIND OF RESTRICTIONS ARE WE GOING TO PUT ON IT AESTHETICALLY SO THAT NOT NECESSARILY MY CONCERN IS THESE TWO PARTICULAR PROPERTIES, BUT IT'S THE PRECEDENT WE'RE SETTING FOR PERHAPS OTHER PROPERTIES IN OTHER AREAS OF TOWN. SEE WHAT I'M SAYING?
>> THAT'S WHAT I'M STRUGGLING WITH.
>> LIKE KIBER RESERVE, FOR EXAMPLE, ON WHAT IS IT, EVANS STREET OR FAIR THAT BACKS UP AND TODAY THEY NOW WANT 10-AND-A-HALF FOOT FENCES AS WELL.
>> HOW TALL IS THE GIRDLE FENCE?
>> THIS ISN'T GOING TO VISUALLY BE DIFFERENT BECAUSE SOMEBODY ALLOWED BUILDING TO BE BUILT UP THAT MUCH HIGHER.
>> WELL, EVEN THE FENCE DOWN HOSPITAL.
THAT FENCE, I'VE NEVER MEASURED IT, BUT I'M ASSUMING IT'S OVER EIGHT FOOT.
>> THOSE ARE PROBABLY SEVEN OR EIGHT.
>> I'VE SEEN ONE HOUSE OVER THERE IN THE NEIGHBORHOOD CLOSER TO THE REC CENTER WITH AT LEAST A 10-FOOT TALL.
IT'S A BRICK FENCE, BUT IT'S LIKE THERE'S A RED BRICK HOUSE. I DON'T KNOW THE ADDRESS.
>> BUT THAT'S GRANDFATHERED BY THE CITY ORDINANCE THOUGH.
>> VISUALLY, THE DIFFERENCE ISN'T YOU'RE NOT NECESSARILY APPROVING SOMEBODY TO HAVE A FENCE LIKE THIS AND SOMEBODY ELSE TO HAVE ONE LIKE THAT.
VISUALLY, THEY'RE GOING TO BE MORE LIKE THIS.
>> ON RIVERWOOD, ONCE THEY STAND IN THEIR BACKYARD, STUART'S FENCE MAY ONLY BE RIGHT HERE. YOU KNOW WHAT I MEAN?
>> OH, NO. I'M NOT WORRIED ABOUT WHAT THE RIVERWOOD RESIDENTS SEE LOOKING YOU ALL'S WAY, OR REALLY EVEN WHAT YOU ALL SEE LOOKING THEIR WAY.
I GUESS MY THOUGHT WAS MORE IN OTHER AREAS OF TOWN THAT ARE NOT TUCKED AWAY BACKING UP TO A DRAINAGE DITCH.
WHAT KIND OF PRECEDENT ARE WE SETTING?
>> JUST TO BE CLEAR ABOUT WHAT MY CONCERN IS.
MAYBE THAT WOULD BE CONCERNING.
>> WELL, NOT NECESSARILY. IF WE GRANTED 10-AND-A-HALF-FOOT FENCE, THEN WE HAD ANOTHER SUBDIVISION AND TWO NEIGHBORS BACK-TO-BACK FEUDING, AND NOW THEY WANT A 10-AND-A-HALF-FOOT FENCE BECAUSE THEY DON'T WANT TO LOOK AT EACH OTHER BECAUSE OF PRIVACY REASONS.
THEN WHAT'S OUR SAY IN, WELL, THIS FENCE GOT IT, BUT NOW I DON'T.
THAT'S WHAT WE'RE MULLING OVER HERE.
>> DO YOU HAVE ANYTHING TO ADD TO THIS?
>> I DO NOT. THESE THINGS NEED TO BE LOOKED AT ON A CASE-BY-CASE BASIS.
I WILL SAY THAT RIVERWOOD RANCH DOES HAVE THAT 20-FOOT DRAINAGE EASEMENT, AND THE HOMES THAT WILL BE BUILT WILL PROBABLY OR MAY HAVE ANOTHER FENCE.
SO THAT AREA HAS TO BE MAINTAINED BY THE HOA TYPICALLY UNDER NORMAL CIRCUMSTANCES.
BUT WE JUST ALERTED THE BOARD, I THINK IN THE REPORT THAT FUTURE REQUESTS MAY COME IN BUT YOU HAVE TO TREAT THOSE ON A CASE-BY-CASE BASIS.
WE WOULD NOT DO THIS ALONG OR RIGHT AWAY, WE WOULD NOT DO THIS WHERE THERE IS SITE VISIBILITY.
I THINK THE LAST ONE YOU DID WAS THE COMMERCIAL CARPET GUY WHERE IT MADE SENSE BECAUSE IT WAS A COMMERCIAL SCREEN APPLICATION AND NOT TO NEIGHBORS TRYING TO DO PRIVACY, AND THE NEIGHBORS WERE ON BOARD WITH IT.
I THINK THEY DO A TAPER ON ONE OF THEIR FENCES THAT BOARDED THAT NEIGHBOR.
[00:55:03]
BUT I THINK YOU'RE SAFE IN THIS INSTANCE.JUST NOTE THAT THE OTHER NEIGHBORS ON COLONY SQUARE MAY BE COMING IN BECAUSE THEY HAVE THE SAME ISSUE.
>> ANY MORE DISCUSSION? SO I WOULD ENTERTAIN A MOTION TO GRANT THE VARIANCE TO SECTION 28-104 FENCING FOR A 10-AND-A-HALF FOOT HIGH PRIVACY FENCE IN THE REAR YARD AT 32 COLONY SQUARE TO TAPER TO THE NEIGHBORING EXISTING FENCE ON THE EAST SIDE.
PLEASE CORRECT ME IF I, OKAY, AND ALSO TO INCLUDE APPROXIMATELY 20 FOOT ON THE NORTHWEST SIDE WITH NO TAPER REQUIRED ON THAT SIDE. ANY DISCUSSION?
>> OH, I'M NOT GOING TO SECOND.
>> DO I GET A SECOND FIRST AND THEN DISCUSS, OR NO?
>> I WOULD LIKE TO MAYBE AMEND THE MOTION SO THAT THERE'S A LITTLE MORE FLEXIBILITY, ESPECIALLY ON THAT WEST SIDE AND I WOULD OFFER AS AN ALTERNATE MOTION, OR DO YOU WANT TO VOTE ON THAT ONE FIRST?
>> OR DO YOU WANT TO HEAR A POSSIBLE AMENDMENT I GUESS? IT WOULD BE TO GRANT A VARIANCE TO SECTION 28-104 FENCING FOR A 10-AND-A-HALF FOOT HIGH PRIVACY FENCE IN THE BOTH SIDES OF THE REAR YARD OF 32 COLONY SQUARE WITH THE SOUTHERN SIDE HAVING TO TAPER DOWN TO THE EXISTING PRIVACY FENCE ON THE EASTERN NEIGHBOR, AND THE WESTERN SIDE OF THE FENCE IF CONTINUED ALL THE WAY TO ANOTHER EXISTING FENCE, HAVING TO TAPER TO THE NEIGHBOR'S PROPERTY ON THE NORTH BECAUSE OF THE ABUTTING NEW DEVELOPMENT SITTING AT A HIGHER ELEVATION.
>> [INAUDIBLE] 10.5 ON THE WEST SIDE.
>> CORRECT. I WOULD ALSO INCLUDE IN THAT VARIANCE 10.5 FEET ON THAT WESTERN FENCE PROVIDED THAT IT TAPERS DOWN, AS I SAID TO THE NORTHERN NEIGHBOR IN THE EVENT THE FENCE IS EXTENDED THAT FAR.
>> I WOULD ENTERTAIN A MOTION TO ACCEPT THE VARIANCE AS AMENDED.
>> MOTION TO ACCEPT THAT AS AMENDED.
>> ANY DISCUSSION? ALL IN FAVOR?
>> MOTION CARRIES. NOW, I WILL NOW ENTERTAIN A MOTION TO ADJOURN THE MEETING.
>> CAN I ASK TO MAKE SURE I UNDERSTAND? I UNDERSTAND BECAUSE SOME PEOPLE ARE GOING TO WANT TO PROBING IN THIS.
TEN-AND-A-HALF ON THE SOUTH SIDE FACING RIVERWOOD AND THEN HE ASKED THE VARIANCE WAS APPROVED TO GO AN ADDITIONAL 20 FEET DOWN THE WEST PROPERTY WITH NO SLOPE, RIGHT? AM I LOOKING EAST? GO AHEAD.
>> AS LONG AS IT'S NOT ABUTTING ANOTHER FENCE.
YEAH, IT CAN END AT 10-AND-A-HALF FEET.
>> HERE, 10-AND-A-HALF, IT WOULD TAPER DOWN HERE?
>> OVER HERE, IT'S 10-AND-A-HALF AND IF IT STOPS, GREAT.
IF IN THE FUTURE YOU KEEP GOING, YOU GOT TO TAPER IN THERE.
>> THAT WAS MY BEARING. THAT WAS MY MOTION. THANK YOU.
>> IS THERE A MOTION TO ADJOURN?
>> OPPOSED? MEETING ADJOURNED AT 12:59.
>> THANK YOU.
* This transcript was compiled from uncorrected Closed Captioning.